New Galleries: Robots In Disguise Tiny Titans

Now that we've seen all the new characters in their Tiny Titans form including, Bisk, Thunderhoof, Hammerstrike, Prowl, and Cliffjumper, will we ever see the Warrior-class figures for all of these characters given above? Don't forget, Steeljaw is the only Decepticon so far that already has a W arrior figure. Therefore, please don't tell us we'll never get a Warrior-class figures for all these brand-new characters, just because kids do hate the Decepticons and love all the Autobots. Because I tell you that almost every single kid really do enjoyed all of these figures, no matter if they are Autobots or Decepticons.

Prowl and Cliffjumper are just the G1 versions. Prowl's gray is likely due to his toy being gang-molded with Bumblebee, Underbite, and Grimlock, with the intention of probably having his body painted white like how Bee's got yellow paint, but it didn't happen for some reason.

As for the rest, Optimus, Bisk, Sideswipe, and Cliffjumper all seem gang-molded in red, while Strongarm, Steeljaw, Thunderhoof, and Hammerstrike all look gang-molded in blue.

That tiny Bisk is adorable. Don't like the other ones.

Minimal paint apps, no articulation, awkward poses... not much to like about these. These make the Robot Heroes line look like Masterpieces by comparison.

Sabrblade wrote:Prowl and Cliffjumper are just the G1 versions. Prowl's gray is likely due to his toy being gang-molded with Bumblebee, Underbite, and Grimlock, with the intention of probably having his body painted white like how Bee's got yellow paint, but it didn't happen for some reason.

As for the rest, Optimus, Bisk, Sideswipe, and Cliffjumper all seem gang-molded in red, while Strongarm, Steeljaw, Thunderhoof, and Hammerstrike all look gang-molded in blue.

Got you covered in the galleries already from when I noticed this while working on the galleries, Sabrblade!

GuyIncognito wrote:Minimal paint apps, no articulation, awkward poses... not much to like about these. These make the Robot Heroes line look like Masterpieces by comparison.

Not to mention their size!

Sabrblade wrote:Prowl and Cliffjumper are just the G1 versions.

What makes you so sure about that? Why would they draw them in the style of RID instead of just reuse existing artwork? Killing Cliffjumper was a stupid move in TFP. I'm sure it gets undone at some point or they just toss continuity out the window, which has already happened with this "Aligned" continuity.

Seibertron wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:Prowl and Cliffjumper are just the G1 versions.

What makes you so sure about that? Why would they draw them in the style of RID instead of just reuse existing artwork? Killing Cliffjumper was a stupid move in TFP. I'm sure it gets undone at some point or they just toss continuity out the window, which has already happened with this "Aligned" continuity.

Pretty sure they killed him just so the viewers would understand that the Decepticons were a threat, to the point where even the faceless lackeys were about to finish off Bumblebee and Arcee before Bulkhead showed up.

Then that AAAALLLLL went out the window too, to the point where Bumblebee and Arcee could mow through 50 Vehicons without effort and Starscream became a whiny coward.

They also might have just killed Cliffjumper because The Rock is an expensive actor. It's like he charges per-word he speaks unless it's a movie deal.

Am I the only one who's reminded of a certain BotCon figures with one of these titans?

Seibertron wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:Prowl and Cliffjumper are just the G1 versions.

What makes you so sure about that? Why would they draw them in the style of RID instead of just reuse existing artwork? Killing Cliffjumper was a stupid move in TFP. I'm sure it gets undone at some point or they just toss continuity out the window, which has already happened with this "Aligned" continuity.

For all we know Cliffjumper could be just someone Optimus runs into during his mission in the afterlife and perhaps team up with each other for a while. It's a possible idea so why don't we see if Cliff manages to appear on the show at all first?

Not that anything is impossible with this stuff, but I feel like it is a bit much to design RiD versions of Prowl and Cliffjumper and there not be a point to it. Here's hoping there's a point to it.

I guess for me it doesn't matter from a toy/collecting perspective as all I purchase is Masterpiece figures, anymore. Over the years I've made kind of a mess of things collecting Prowls and Magnuses, so when there's a new one shown I at least look at them.

sol magnus wrote:Not that anything is impossible with this stuff, but I feel like it is a bit much to design RiD versions of Prowl and Cliffjumper and there not be a point to it. Here's hoping there's a point to it.

I guess for me it doesn't matter from a toy/collecting perspective as all I purchase is Masterpiece figures, anymore. Over the years I've made kind of a mess of things collecting Prowls and Magnuses, so when there's a new one shown I at least look at them.

As much as I doubt it, I do wish in my heart of hearts that Prowl could make an appearance. I've always liked his look in spite of his tendency towards prickishness in recent media. Maybe as Strongarm's senior officer/instructor who she looks up to more than Bee?

I doubt this Cliffy means anything to Prime CJ and his death. I'm with whoever has said it's just a G1 Cliffy thrown into this line because why not, rather than that he's gonna actually be in the new RID (assuming RID actually is a real followup to Prime).

Aligned doesn't really mean anything, no matter what Hasbro may have claimed (or how TFwiki might try to categorize the characters). It's as pointless to try and reconcile stuff like Prime with WFC as it is to try and reconcile G1 with (the original) RID or any other two disparate universes. Hell, it's hard enough to try and get the three UT series to fit, but aligned, nope, no way. Just some marketing gobbledygook that somehow got outta hand.

Seibertron wrote:

GuyIncognito wrote:Minimal paint apps, no articulation, awkward poses... not much to like about these. These make the Robot Heroes line look like Masterpieces by comparison.

Not to mention their size!

Heh, I've got a Prowl eraser somewhere (I think I got it Christmas 84... holy shit 30 years ago...) that's larger and more detailed than these.

And if they had to mold Prowl out of gray plastic, probably should have made him Bluestreak.

Optimum Supreme wrote:I doubt this Cliffy means anything to Prime CJ and his death. I'm with whoever has said it's just a G1 Cliffy thrown into this line because why not, rather than that he's gonna actually be in the new RID (assuming RID actually is a real followup to Prime).

Aligned doesn't really mean anything, no matter what Hasbro may have claimed (or how TFwiki might try to categorize the characters). It's as pointless to try and reconcile stuff like Prime with WFC as it is to try and reconcile G1 with (the original) RID or any other two disparate universes. Hell, it's hard enough to try and get the three UT series to fit, but aligned, nope, no way. Just some marketing gobbledygook that somehow got outta hand.

I'm right there with you. I think it's silly that they even tried to tie what was obviously a G1 expansion story (or reinterpretation) with Transformers Prime. It has felt extremely forced since the moment they said something along the lines of "hey, chocolate chip cookies are great dipped in IPA Beer!" No thanks! I really wish they had worked with IDW to have the WFC/FOC games tie-in with the IDW comics instead. The aesthetics and personalities and history of the characters would have flowed much better if they had just ironed out the details instead of forcing Transformers Prime onto WFC/FOC.

Hell, they couldn't even really keep Rescue Bots as part of the main Transformers Prime continuity without really squinting your eyes after a few drinks and pretend a lot.

I called BS when they first announced that TFP, Rescue Bots and WFC were part of the same continuity. They can try all they want, but it just doesn't work at the end of the day. More so because of Hasbro ... storytelling and congruent continuity just isn't their specialty. Making toys and marketing is their specialty. Trying to keep all of these different facets of the Transformers brand congruent amongst changing employees and rapidly changing brand strategies a midst fierce competition is difficult. I commend them for trying, but wish they'd stick to what they do best.

On the flipside though, this reminds me of the various G1 micro-continuities that exist with the Find Your Own Adventure books, the kiddie-Marvel Books, the Marvel US Transformers comics, the Marvel UK Transformers comics, the G1 cartoon, and so on. At the end of the day, as much as we want to think Transformers is the greatest thing since sliced bread, any books, comics, cartoons, game, etc serve one sole purpose with Transformers and that is to sell more toys. Bottom line, end of story. Anything else that we get, as much as we try to believe it to be something greater, is just to fulfill that purpose. As soon as the toys die out, just like they did in the early 90s, the media facets and expanded universe type things that we get will die out as well.

On that note, I simply try to just enjoy whatever iterations that we have of the Transformers, regardless if it fits perfectly into any one overall continuity. I would rather have had WFC, Rescue Bots and Transformers Prime just been there own thing. If fans draw connections on their own, that's one thing, but to have Hasbro say "they're all part of the same continuity", that's where I'm calling BS because they didn't do that with G1, but we're fine with just taking it or leaving it with that stuff.

Seibertron wrote:

Optimum Supreme wrote:I doubt this Cliffy means anything to Prime CJ and his death. I'm with whoever has said it's just a G1 Cliffy thrown into this line because why not, rather than that he's gonna actually be in the new RID (assuming RID actually is a real followup to Prime).

Aligned doesn't really mean anything, no matter what Hasbro may have claimed (or how TFwiki might try to categorize the characters). It's as pointless to try and reconcile stuff like Prime with WFC as it is to try and reconcile G1 with (the original) RID or any other two disparate universes. Hell, it's hard enough to try and get the three UT series to fit, but aligned, nope, no way. Just some marketing gobbledygook that somehow got outta hand.

I'm right there with you. I think it's silly that they even tried to tie what was obviously a G1 expansion story (or reinterpretation) with Transformers Prime. It has felt extremely forced since the moment they said something along the lines of "hey, chocolate chip cookies are great dipped in IPA Beer!" No thanks! I really wish they had worked with IDW to have the WFC/FOC games tie-in with the IDW comics instead. The aesthetics and personalities and history of the characters would have flowed much better if they had just ironed out the details instead of forcing Transformers Prime onto WFC/FOC.

At this point, I think we can really take or leave the Aligned model. Aside from Cliff's horns and Bee's disappearing voice, there's very little to connect the games to Prime.

Shuttershock wrote:At this point, I think we can really take or leave the Aligned model. Aside from Cliff's horns and Bee's disappearing voice, there's very little to connect the games to Prime.

Uh...

Sabrblade wrote:

Shuttershock wrote:At this point, I think we can really take or leave the Aligned model. Aside from Cliff's horns and Bee's disappearing voice, there's very little to connect the games to Prime.

Uh...

Like he said, there's very little to connect the games to Prime. That series seemed extremely forced. Now, had Arcee, Prime or any of the other characters appeared in that series alongside the Dinobots and had one of the Dinobots (namely Grimlock) had gone on to season 3 to battle Predaking, it'd be a different story and I'd be commending them for the effort. But without that, this just ranks slightly above fan-fiction in my book.

Sabrblade wrote:

Shuttershock wrote:At this point, I think we can really take or leave the Aligned model. Aside from Cliff's horns and Bee's disappearing voice, there's very little to connect the games to Prime.

Uh...

Show me the Dinobots IN a Prime episode and that has bearing with me.

It's Hasbro's fault for granting so much leeway and creative freedom to each individual branch instead of picking one design aesthetic and asking each branch to kindly stick to that.

But hey, just goes to show how little Hasbro cares about visual consistency compared to how much the fans do.

At least they all got Cybertron's Core and the Nemesis looking them same across the board:






It's obvious that they wanted them to all be the same story, but the variety of looks have put off many to the very idea.

And yet, Beast Machines and G1 have staggeringly different aesthetics yet so many will argue to the grave that those two are connected.

From a storytelling perspective, it was a bad idea for Hasbro to first give us WFC and then Prime immediately after. Doing that was the equivalent of watching Beast Machines immediately after the first three episodes of G1.

If they could just publish that Binder of Revelation of theirs (cuz that Covenant of Primus book was hardly an acceptable substitute), fans could consider that the true canon of Aligned and discard all other games, books, cartoons, comics, etc. (WFC/FOC and Prime included in that mass discarding).

Sabrblade wrote:It's Hasbro's fault for granting so much leeway and creative freedom to each individual branch instead of picking one design aesthetic and asking each branch to kindly stick to that.

But hey, just goes to show how little Hasbro cares about visual consistency compared to how much the fans do.

At least they all got Cybertron's Core and the Nemesis looking them same across the board:






It's obvious that they wanted them to all be the same story, but the variety of looks have put off many to the very idea.

And yet, Beast Machines and G1 have staggeringly different aesthetics yet so many will argue to the grave that those two are connected.

From a storytelling perspective, it was a bad idea for Hasbro to first give us WFC and then Prime immediately after. Doing that was the equivalent of watching Beast Machines immediately after the first three episodes of G1.

If they could just publish that Binder of Revelation of theirs (cuz that Covenant of Primus book was hardly an acceptable substitute), fans could consider that the true canon of Aligned and discard all other games, books, cartoons, comics, etc. (WFC/FOC and Prime included in that mass discarding).

The design incongruities are what amounts to a circle jerk in the Aligned world. WFC had a planet core, Prime copied that core design. Prime had the Nemesis and CJ's horns, FOC took those aspects.

It's just irritating that these stories, good and and bad in their own ways, would be shoehorned together by executive mandate. See also "Rise of the Dark Spark", which amounts to a cheap knock off Cybertron game being forcibly lashed to the movie universe in spite of drastically different art styles and directions.

Sabrblade wrote:And yet, Beast Machines and G1 have staggeringly different aesthetics yet so many will argue to the grave that those two are connected.

That's an interesting point ... one of which I'm sure there are many fans who equally despise the fact that Beast Machines is the swan song to G1. I could care less either way. At the time, it was really nice to see the Beast Wars era tie-in with G1. There had never been a precedent of multi-universes in the world of Transformers yet so it made sense at the time, hence the acceptance of many fans. But these days, with so many multi-universes of Transformers that if Hasbro says "this is all the same continuity", they had better dot their i's and cross their t's. Otherwise, it's just back to basics with fans connecting the dots.

Hasbro needs a story editor who oversees all of the different iterations of the Transformers and does their damnedest to make everything flow together that is supposed to.

Shuttershock wrote:See also "Rise of the Dark Spark", which amounts to a cheap knock off Cybertron game being forcibly lashed to the movie universe in spite of drastically different art styles and directions.

At leat that game has the benefit of keeping WFC/FOC and AOE as separate alternate universes rather than foolishly putting them together.

That game even had G1 as another separate world from the G1-inspired WFC/FOC, so even regardless of whether or not WFC/FOC was a part of Aligned, Rise of the Dark Spark hammers in the fact that WFC/FOC is a different reality from G1.

Seibertron wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:And yet, Beast Machines and G1 have staggeringly different aesthetics yet so many will argue to the grave that those two are connected.

That's an interesting point ... one of which I'm sure there are many fans who equally despise the fact that Beast Machines is the swan song to G1. I could care less either way. At the time, it was really nice to see the Beast Wars era tie-in with G1. There had never been a precedent of multi-universes in the world of Transformers yet so it made sense at the time, hence the acceptance of many fans. But these days, with so many multi-universes of Transformers that if Hasbro says "this is all the same continuity", they had better dot their i's and cross their t's. Otherwise, it's just back to basics with fans connecting the dots.

Hasbro needs a story editor who oversees all of the different iterations of the Transformers and does their damnedest to make everything flow together that is supposed to.

Captain John Barberosa of the Good Ship Continuity, perhaps?

Sabrblade wrote:

Shuttershock wrote:See also "Rise of the Dark Spark", which amounts to a cheap knock off Cybertron game being forcibly lashed to the movie universe in spite of drastically different art styles and directions.

At leat that game has the benefit of keeping WFC/FOC and AOE as separate alternate universes rather than foolishly putting them together.

That game even had G1 as another separate world from the G1-inspired WFC/FOC, so even regardless of whether or not WFC/FOC was a part of Aligned, Rise of the Dark Spark hammers in the fact that WFC/FOC is a different reality from G1.

It seemed pretty obvious to me that FOC ended right where the G1 cartoon should have started. I thought for sure that in 2014 we'd have gotten a FOC sequel to commemorate the 30th anniversary complete with true-blue 30th anniversary toys ala Masters of the Universe Classics that would have been basically retail versions of Masterpiece figures but with modern looking vehicles. Apparently my pipe dream was wrong!

Seibertron wrote:Hasbro needs a story editor who oversees all of the different iterations of the Transformers and does their damnedest to make everything flow together that is supposed to.

I agree with this, but... sadly, Hasbro just doesn't care as much as we do. "Continuity" to Hasbro means what "Continuity Family" means to us.

However, let me ask you this. Would you have been more accepting to the idea of Prime and WFC being related if we started with WFC first, then got more media that continued onward from where WFC left off, with all of the fiction being released in chronological order, and then several years later, after a LARGE amount of the story had been told (the launch from Cybertron, the space-faring plant-hopping journey, the long-awaited arrival on Earth, the establishing of the Autobot's Earth base, etc.), we then got finally Prime, at which point we would have seen the evolution of aesthetics from G1-based to Movie/Animated-based occur over time (as we did with G1 --> Beast Wars --> Beast Machines)... instead of how we got the two as we did with us jumping from WFC straight into Prime?

...wow, what a surprise, more "Alligned" so-called continuity that contradicts itself, I am so shocked...*yawn*

Sabrblade wrote:

Seibertron wrote:Hasbro needs a story editor who oversees all of the different iterations of the Transformers and does their damnedest to make everything flow together that is supposed to.

I agree with this, but... sadly, Hasbro just doesn't care as much as we do. "Continuity" to Hasbro means what "Continuity Family" means to us.

However, let me ask you this. Would you have been more accepting to the idea of Prime and WFC being related if we started with WFC first, then got more media that continued onward from where WFC left off, with all of the fiction being released in chronological order, and then several years later, after a LARGE amount of the story had been told, we got finally Prime, at which point we would have seen the evolution of aesthetics from G1-based to Movie/Animated-based occur over time (as we did with G1 --> Beast Wars --> Beast Machines)... instead of how we got them with us jumping from WFC straight into Prime?

If it means a proper evolution of characters over time and a seeing the stories of people we grow to love (and hate) go all the way to the end, then absolutely yes. But you'd almost have to stick to one medium to do that.

To me, the problem of aligned universes across multiple forms of media is that you might not get the whole story if you ONLY play games or ONLY watch the show or ONLY read the comics. And because of the different demographics and tones of each medium (not to mention development time), there will certainly be inconsistencies between the characters.

Sabrblade wrote:

Seibertron wrote:Hasbro needs a story editor who oversees all of the different iterations of the Transformers and does their damnedest to make everything flow together that is supposed to.

I agree with this, but... sadly, Hasbro just doesn't care as much as we do. "Continuity" to Hasbro means what "Continuity Family" means to us.

However, let me ask you this. Would you have been more accepting to the idea of Prime and WFC being related if we started with WFC first, then got more media that continued onward from where WFC left off, with all of the fiction being released in chronological order, and then several years later, after a LARGE amount of the story had been told (the launch from Cybertron, the space-faring plant-hopping journey, the long-awaited arrival on Earth, the establishing of the Autobot's Earth base, etc.), we then got finally Prime, at which point we would have seen the evolution of aesthetics from G1-based to Movie/Animated-based occur over time (as we did with G1 --> Beast Wars --> Beast Machines)... instead of how we got the two as we did with us jumping from WFC straight into Prime?

That sounds less appealing to me. I'm just not into WFC/FOC being part of Transformers Prime. It was unnecessary. WFC/FOC should have given G1 fans a modern retelling of G1 that could have tied in with IDW if it had to tie in with something (or just let fans use their imaginations to what it ties in with) or just kept it as a background story for G1 cartoon which we hadn't gotten that much of in the past (but that would've meant rewriting major parts of WFC/FOC or retconning parts of G1 which fans would have complained about as well, hence the idea of working it into IDW universe where those issues could be dealt with easily. That would have been wonderful, could have tied in with the current Generations toy line, kept similar aesthetics, and probably have been much more accepted. But to try to force WFC/FOC into Prime instead of a G1 Universe just has seemed silly since day one to me. Mind you, WFC/FOC was rolled out before the new Hasbro team came onboard so the idea of working with IDW to come up with ways to tie in Generations just wasn't around (even though I'd been saying it since day one of Classics toys and IDW comics).

Seibertron wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:

Seibertron wrote:Hasbro needs a story editor who oversees all of the different iterations of the Transformers and does their damnedest to make everything flow together that is supposed to.

I agree with this, but... sadly, Hasbro just doesn't care as much as we do. "Continuity" to Hasbro means what "Continuity Family" means to us.

However, let me ask you this. Would you have been more accepting to the idea of Prime and WFC being related if we started with WFC first, then got more media that continued onward from where WFC left off, with all of the fiction being released in chronological order, and then several years later, after a LARGE amount of the story had been told (the launch from Cybertron, the space-faring plant-hopping journey, the long-awaited arrival on Earth, the establishing of the Autobot's Earth base, etc.), we then got finally Prime, at which point we would have seen the evolution of aesthetics from G1-based to Movie/Animated-based occur over time (as we did with G1 --> Beast Wars --> Beast Machines)... instead of how we got the two as we did with us jumping from WFC straight into Prime?

That sounds less appealing to me. I'm just not into WFC/FOC being part of Transformers Prime. It was unnecessary. They should have used WFC/FOC to give G1 fans a modern retelling of G1 that should have tied in with IDW. That would have been wonderful, could have tied in with the current Generations toy line, kept similar aesthetics, and probably have been much more accepted. But to try to force WFC/FOC into Prime instead of a G1 Universe just has seemed silly since day one to me. Mind you, WFC/FOC was rolled out before the new Hasbro team came onboard so the idea of working with IDW to come up with ways to tie in Generations just wasn't around (even though I'd been saying it since day one of Classics toys and IDW comics).

Funny that, especially when WFC Prime, Megs, BB and Soundwave were all made Generations figures, and were some of the best designs in that early line.

Seibertron wrote:It's like Hasbro's right on the very edge of getting "it" and just won't reach over and grab it. So, it doesn't surprise me if they made the aligned continuity a mess. I'd hate to be the guy they hire to come in with a catch all story that goes back and fixes everything and ties up all the loose ends, that would be a hellish job.

I think you hit the nail on the head here. I'm sure some employees at Hasbro do get it. The problem is that Hasbro's got a marketing department, a sales department, a bunch of white shirts, a development team in the US and in Japan, and everyone has their own ideas of what needs to happen to make this brand make money. I think what we ultimately end up seeing at retail with the finished products are a lot of compromises to make all of the different departments and people at the company happy and employed in these crazy times where there is so much to compete with Transformers besides transforming robots like there were back in the 80s.

Shuttershock wrote:If it means a proper evolution of characters over time and a seeing the stories of people we grow to love (and hate) go all the way to the end, then absolutely yes. But you'd almost have to stick to one medium to do that.

To me, the problem of aligned universes across multiple forms of media is that you might not get the whole story if you ONLY play games or ONLY watch the show or ONLY read the comics. And because of the different demographics and tones of each medium (not to mention development time), there will certainly be inconsistencies between the characters.

The multiple mediums thing did make it difficult to follow, which goes to show how ambitious and confident Hasbro felt in the whole thing, believing fans would be willing to play all of the games, watch all the shows, read all the books, follow all the comics, etc. Evidently, though, their expectations were too high, and ironically almost none of the people behind this whole project are even at Hasbro anymore.

But, from a business standpoint, it made sense for them to want to broaden their horizons rather than stifle themselves into just one or two mediums. It's just that not every fan was willing to goal along with their visions and goals for a multimedia world. And sadly, that unwillingness seems to fit within the same mindset as those fans who look down upon new and different ideas that steer the brand further away from its G1 roots, and that mindset can simply be summed up as this: "The Transformers fandom is resistent to 'change'."

Think about it. Every time Hasbro or Takara does something that pays homage to the past (like the G1-based Generations or Masterpieces, or the occasional Beast Wars or Unicron Trilogy nod), they get praised for it. But every time something new and strikingly different from G1 enters the scene (like Beast Wars at first, Beast Machines still, Animated, the movies, Prime, or the upcoming RID series), it receives far less praise and more ridicule than the aforementioned tributes to the past do.

Take Prime Wheeljack, for instance. When asked by the Prime creators which character they could use for a Wrecker/warrior type, Hasbro said Wheeljack. It was a new take on an older concept that was redone from the ground up, minus his visual look being a decent throwback to the original. Yet, just because he wasn't exactly like G1 Wheeljack in personality, he got bashed by a huge amount of the fandom that also wrongfully accused him of being a knockoff of G1 Drift (which is completely ludicrous since Drift was never a Wrecker nor had any real personality whatsoever at that point, unlike Wheeljack who was oozing with personality) and wrote off the character simply for his being different.

Bottom line, a large part of the fandom is stuck in the past while Hasbro wants to keep moving forward. That's partly why Hasbro keeps showing resistance to making a new G1 cartoon or a new G1-based movie, leaving only things like comics and video games being allowed to rehash G1. Hasbro very obviously is trying to get away from G1 in their most mainstream media, though being willing enough to throw in some nods and small homages here and there, but more willing to make things look and be new and distinct on their own, without having to constantly fall back on the decades-old media.

those stickers or tampo sigils are fugly barf.. how did they think that would look good. I like the design though. Is it really too hard to give these guys elbow joints though? They'd rock with those. I do want to get the small legion class ones though if they have a complete set of the show to go along with my prime verse, but I'm not spending money on them if it's incomplete and I'm not buying the bigger ones.

Ah, Continuity...

The thing to be kept in mind, I think, is that all of these stories were written independently and simultaneously by different people and companies. You'll never iron out inconsistancies, becase High Moon, IDW, and the Prime producers (who was that?) were not all talking to each other, and Hasbro was not leaning over their shoulders telling them what to write.

In general, that seems to be the preferred way, or that's the impression I am getting. Hasbro lays out the basics in the Production Bibles, and then like kids on Christmas, tells the writing staff to "Go Play", hoping maybe to spark ifferent imaginatiions and play patterns. Maybe their being too lassiaz-faire (my apologies to the French for butchering that) but it seems like I've read on here about other toylines/manufacturers controlling the story too much that the writing comes out robotic.

Sabrblade wrote:

Shuttershock wrote:If it means a proper evolution of characters over time and a seeing the stories of people we grow to love (and hate) go all the way to the end, then absolutely yes. But you'd almost have to stick to one medium to do that.

To me, the problem of aligned universes across multiple forms of media is that you might not get the whole story if you ONLY play games or ONLY watch the show or ONLY read the comics. And because of the different demographics and tones of each medium (not to mention development time), there will certainly be inconsistencies between the characters.

The multiple mediums thing did make it difficult to follow, which goes to show how ambitious and confident Hasbro felt in the whole thing, believing fans would be willing to play all of the games, watch all the shows, read all the books, follow all the comics, etc. Evidently, though, their expectations were too high, and ironically almost none of the people behind this whole project are even at Hasbro anymore.

But, from a business standpoint, it made sense for them to want to broaden their horizons rather than stifle themselves into just one or two mediums. It's just that not every fan was willing to goal along with their visions and goals for a multimedia world. And sadly, that unwillingness seems to fit within the same mindset as those fans who look down upon new and different ideas that steer the brand further away from its G1 roots, and that mindset can simply be summed up as this: "The Transformers fandom is resistent to 'change'."

Think about it. Every time Hasbro or Takara does something that pays homage to the past (like the G1-based Generations or Masterpieces, or the occasional Beast Wars or Unicron Trilogy nod), they get praised for it. But every time something new and strikingly different from G1 enters the scene (like Beast Wars at first, Beast Machines still, Animated, the movies, Prime, or the upcoming RID series), it receives far less praise and more ridicule than the aforementioned tributes to the past do.

Take Prime Wheeljack, for instance. When asked by the Prime creators which character they could use for a Wrecker/warrior type, Hasbro said Wheeljack. It was a new take on an older concept that was redone from the ground up, minus his visual look being a decent throwback to the original. Yet, just because he wasn't exactly like G1 Wheeljack in personality, he got bashed by a huge amount of the fandom that also wrongfully accused him of being a knockoff of G1 Drift (which is completely ludicrous since Drift was never a Wrecker nor had any real personality whatsoever at that point, unlike Wheeljack who was oozing with personality) and wrote off the character simply for his being different.

Bottom line, a large part of the fandom is stuck in the past while Hasbro wants to keep moving forward. That's partly why Hasbro keeps showing resistance to making a new G1 cartoon or a new G1-based movie, leaving only things like comics and video games being allowed to rehash G1. Hasbro very obviously is trying to get away from G1 in their most mainstream media, though being willing enough to throw in some nods and small homages here and there, but more willing to make things look and be new and distinct on their own, without having to constantly fall back on the decades-old media.

You make a lot of good points. I grew up on Beast Wars, Machines and Armada, so I'm kind of adrift with styles and willing to let artistic choices be fluid. Nowadays I'm more of a story/character hound, so style is less important than substance. I don't like the movies because I don't feel the characters or their struggles have depth. Animated has great storylines once you get past the pallet and some of the rougher elements. I didn't like Prime Wheeljack because he's was a smug unbeatable loner, but those were his character flaws to overcome or not.

I'm not calling you out or saying you're wrong, just giving you the perspective of a fan not tied to G1 or resistant to the prospect of change.

Shuttershock wrote:You make a lot of good points. I grew up on Beast Wars, Machines and Armada, so I'm kind of adrift with styles and willing to let artistic choices be fluid. Nowadays I'm more of a story/character hound, so style is less important than substance. I don't like the movies because I don't feel the characters or their struggles have depth. Animated has great storylines once you get past the pallet and some of the rougher elements. I didn't like Prime Wheeljack because he's was a smug unbeatable loner, but those were his character flaws to overcome or not.

I'm not calling you out or saying you're wrong, just giving you the perspective of a fan not tied to G1 or resistant to the prospect of change.

And I'm right there with ya on just about all those points (save for Prime Wheeljack, as I did like him and he did overcome those definite character flaws). It just pains me to see how much of this fandom is so grounded in G1 that all else less appealing (not completely unappealing, but still inferior to a degree). It honestly makes me wonder how different things would be if Classics, Universe (2008), and Generations (and by extension, a huge amount of third parties) never existed, as I honestly feel as though those lines have played a huge part in keeping the brand anchored in the past rather than being completely free to sail off on nonstop course into the future.

Flashwave wrote:Ah, Continuity...

The thing to be kept in mind, I think, is that all of these stories were written independently and simultaneously by different people and companies. You'll never iron out inconsistancies, becase High Moon, IDW, and the Prime producers (who was that?) were not all talking to each other, and Hasbro was not leaning over their shoulders telling them what to write.

In general, that seems to be the preferred way, or that's the impression I am getting. Hasbro lays out the basics in the Production Bibles, and then like kids on Christmas, tells the writing staff to "Go Play", hoping maybe to spark ifferent imaginatiions and play patterns. Maybe their being too lassiaz-faire (my apologies to the French for butchering that) but it seems like I've read on here about other toylines/manufacturers controlling the story too much that the writing comes out robotic.

I agree with you, but if there's no one trying to keep things in line story/character wise then I'd say they'd be better off considered as independent from one another.

Sabrblade wrote:

Shuttershock wrote:You make a lot of good points. I grew up on Beast Wars, Machines and Armada, so I'm kind of adrift with styles and willing to let artistic choices be fluid. Nowadays I'm more of a story/character hound, so style is less important than substance. I don't like the movies because I don't feel the characters or their struggles have depth. Animated has great storylines once you get past the pallet and some of the rougher elements. I didn't like Prime Wheeljack because he's was a smug unbeatable loner, but those were his character flaws to overcome or not.

I'm not calling you out or saying you're wrong, just giving you the perspective of a fan not tied to G1 or resistant to the prospect of change.

And I'm right there with ya on just about all those points (save for Prime Wheeljack, as I did like him and he did overcome those definite character flaws). It just pains me to see how much of this fandom is so grounded in G1 that all else less appealing (not completely unappealing, but still inferior to a degree). It honestly makes me wonder how different things would be if Classics, Universe (2008), and Generations (and by extension, a huge amount of third parties) never existed, as I honestly feel as though those lines have played a huge part in keeping the brand anchored in the past rather than being completely free to sail off on nonstop course into the future.

True, one man's fond memories are another man's anchor. I don't condemn what CHUG does since at the end of the day they put out (for the most part) solid toys with good engineering and articulation, but that's an interesting thought.

But hey, I'm holding out for a return (comics, shows or otherwise) of Armada Demolishor or Cybertron Thunderblast, so what do I know? If Armada Starscream and RID Sky-Byte can come back in IDW, anything's on the table.

My $40 investment into an early batch of these Tiny Titans has turned into a good investment for our discussion. Thanks everyone for making it worth my while! Love to see all of us discussing our views on all of this.

Seibertron wrote:My $40 investment into an early batch of these Tiny Titans has turned into a good investment for our discussion. Thanks everyone for making it worth my while! Love to see all of us discussing our views on all of this.

I didn't participate, but I did learn a few things just reading through. I've been confused by the Aligned stuff since the get-go, perhaps that's why I never got into it much. I never finished either of the games, nor the Prime series. I also thought WFC would be better as a pre-G1 setting, rather than for Prime. I also have the comics mentioned earlier, and I agree that they were rather weak. Nonetheless, they are there, and the aforementioned wish for a person to edit everything together or come in and write some backstory or fill-in to connect all the dots officially, could use that comic story as a basis. But there needs to be a LOT of character development.

In all honesty, I really don't see how WFC/FOC are any more G1-based than some of the other heavily homage-based non-G1 lines like Energon and Animated. Some have even argued that Animated Megatron's Earth Robot Mode looked more like G1 Megatron than WFC Megatron did. The only things about the WFC designs that really look that much directly G1-based to me are most of the head designs and color schemes, the latter of which could even be argued as being much less significant since the aforementioned homage lines already made use of those color schemes to the point that keeping those colors schemes is hardly worth mentioning anymore (and only becomes noticeable with a G1-named character appears in a series in which it doesn't use the G1 deco, like Movie Ironhide being black or Prime Arcee being blue).

So really, it's the just heads that look directly G1-based, and not even all of them.

Rodimus Prime wrote:

Seibertron wrote:My $40 investment into an early batch of these Tiny Titans has turned into a good investment for our discussion. Thanks everyone for making it worth my while! Love to see all of us discussing our views on all of this.

I didn't participate, but I did learn a few things just reading through. I've been confused by the Aligned stuff since the get-go, perhaps that's why I never got into it much. I never finished either of the games, nor the Prime series. I also thought WFC would be better as a pre-G1 setting, rather than for Prime. I also have the comics mentioned earlier, and I agree that they were rather weak. Nonetheless, they are there, and the aforementioned wish for a person to edit everything together or come in and write some backstory or fill-in to connect all the dots officially, could use that comic story as a basis. But there needs to be a LOT of character development.

I always saw the WFC game as being a prequel to the G1 cartoon simply because it works. Maybe not in style, but all the key points are there. And its also works as a prequel to Prime. Both shows speak of a long war between two parties and this game is about said war, so why cant it work for both?

william-james88 wrote:I always saw the WFC game as being a prequel to the G1 cartoon simply because it works. Maybe not in style, but all the key points are there.

There are more differences between WFC and the G1 cartoon than just their looks. For one, Optimus got the Matrix from Alpha Trion in the cartoon, while he got it from the Core in the game. And Dark Energon wasn't a thing in the cartoon either. And both the Aerialbots and Breakdown existed on Cybertron in the game when they weren't born in the cartoon until 1985. And Jetfire's an Autobot in the game when he left Cybertron before the war began in the cartoon. Other differences exist as well.

I definitely think WFC (I only played the first one, "Dark Energon featuring Dark Energon with a guest appearance by Dark Energon") works fine as a prequel to Prime. I think it works, well...not at all as a prequel to the G1 cartoon (although even the G1 cartoon contradicts the early origins of the war at least).

However, as one of those people that gravitates to G1, I suppose I should attempt to defend it somewhat. I don't have a problem with other forms of continuity or what have you. I do have somewhat of a problem with radically altering a character from the "base" because what's the point of coming up with the character in the first place - it essentially becomes a name and an appearance rather than a character. I don't think it's completely verboten to do this, either. I guess it just depends. The source material for the characters varied back in the day, too...so people kind of just picked the one they liked the best. If you liked Prowl and were exposed to all the stuff that gave you information on Prowl, which interpretation served the character the best for you? Bio/Tech Spec, G1 comic fiction, or G1 cartoon? In his bio he's evidently a high ranking, very competent character - in the comic he's kind of the same, but there's not much with him (in the early US version), and in the comic he might be kind of the same but he comes off as bland, and the "logic" aspect of his character makes him come off as kind of a wet blanket. But it all fits as the "base" character. Competent? Check. Smart? Check. Not very interesting at all. Yet his visual look has always made him an appealing character. Not even getting into which continuity took "precedence", although I'd have to go with the cartoon due to simple exposure.

That's just an example that none of this is new - there just wasn't a fully developed 24 hour news cycle or internet to share these ideas across the entire planet...but they definitely existed in my neighborhood all the way back to '84.

K2vox wrote:those stickers or tampo sigils are fugly barf.. how did they think that would look good. I like the design though. Is it really too hard to give these guys elbow joints though? They'd rock with those. I do want to get the small legion class ones though if they have a complete set of the show to go along with my prime verse, but I'm not spending money on them if it's incomplete and I'm not buying the bigger ones.

Those tampos are gly, but they are designed to be QR Code-esqe. You can scan them into a game that way.

Sabrblade wrote:

william-james88 wrote:I always saw the WFC game as being a prequel to the G1 cartoon simply because it works. Maybe not in style, but all the key points are there.

There are more differences between WFC and the G1 cartoon than just their looks. For one, Optimus got the Matrix from Alpha Trion in the cartoon, while he got it from the Core in the game. And Dark Energon wasn't a thing in the cartoon either. And both the Aerialbots and Breakdown existed on Cybertron in the game when they weren't born in the cartoon until 1985. And Jetfire's an Autobot in the game when he left Cybertron before the war began in the cartoon. Other differences exist as well.

Well, technically, there's that whole Timetravel episode, maybe the Airelbots were around in the past longer than we saw...

Well, WFC/FOC can't be part of the G1 cartoon continuity as they directly contradict each other.

In the cartoon, the Dinobots are built on Earth by Wheeljack and Ratchet. In FOC the Dinobots were originally normal Autobots who got turned into monsters by Shockwave.

In the cartoon, Shockwave stayed monitoring Cybertron, whilst in FOC Grimlock kills him.

In the cartoon, the Insecticons are dropped from the wreck of the Nemesis in an escape pod and crash-land on Earth, where they take on insect modes. In FOC, the Insecticons are already insects, and the Dinobots kill them.

In the cartoon, Starscream in on the Nemesis with the rest of the Decepticons. In FOC, he seemingly dies.

In the cartoon, the Combaticons were Decepticon criminals that Starscream liberated and gave new bodies. In FOC they were a perfectly loyal team of Decepticons who was on the Nemesis until his battle with Jazz sent him spiralling into the void (or possibly back to Cybertron).

I could go on, but regardless, I think it's obvious that G1 and WFC/FOC are separate continuities. That said I agree that the Aligned concept makes absolutely no sense, and in my book the WFC/FOC and Prime universes should be kept separate.

Delta Magnus wrote:In the cartoon, Shockwave stayed monitoring Cybertron, whilst in FOC Grimlock kills him.

Grilock doesn't kill him, he just defeats him.

Delta Magnus wrote:In the cartoon, the Insecticons are dropped from the wreck of the Nemesis in an escape pod and crash-land on Earth, where they take on insect modes. In FOC, the Insecticons are already insects, and the Dinobots kill them.

They don't kill all of the Insecticons, just a lot of them. Hardshell, Sharpshot, and Kickback were all beaten, but not killed.

Delta Magnus wrote:In the cartoon, Starscream in on the Nemesis with the rest of the Decepticons. In FOC, he seemingly dies.

He's knocked aside, but not killed. The books account for his being aboard the Nemesis.

Delta Magnus wrote:In the cartoon, the Combaticons were Decepticon criminals that Starscream liberated and gave new bodies. In FOC they were a perfectly loyal team of Decepticons who was on the Nemesis until his battle with Jazz sent him spiralling into the void (or possibly back to Cybertron).

The latter. They do make it back to Cybertron.

Delta Magnus wrote:I could go on, but regardless, I think it's obvious that G1 and WFC/FOC are separate continuities.

Yeah, Rise of the Dark Spark even cements G1 as a separate reality from WFC/FOC.

All I know is I'm counting the WfC/FoC figures as their G1 versions on my shelves.


... and that the Tiny Titan things look really cheap. I get that's the point, but still not anything I'd want.
I have to wonder how the "regular" toy of Bisk will handle the face. Neither the Kreon or this one even bother with the eyestalks, though obviously those two figures are very tiny.

We brought you a video review over the weekend of the second wave of Transformers: Robots in Disguise Legion class figures, featuring Grimlock and Sideswipe - but why not take a second look at both of them, alongside the three-step Hyperchange Optimus Prime?

Click on any of the images below to access the full galleries for Grimlock, Sideswipe and Optimus Prime, each with simplified transformation, symbol to be scanned with the RID mobile device app, and more to be discovered - below.

Transformers: Robots In Disguise (2015) Grimlock








Transformers: Robots In Disguise (2015) Sideswipe








Transformers: Robots In Disguise (2015) Optimus Prime