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BotsNotPlots wrote:I feel like the US price ($180) for this is definitely worth backing, but the UK price (£180) makes it a tough choice. This makes it out to be about £50/$70 difference, and I'd very much like to know where the extra cash is going.

We've seen this before were hasbro takes another currencies price and just swaps the currency sign. It is weird though ik sure there's a weird/logical business reason behind it...though it could also laziness to having to worry about fluctuating currency conversions

BotsNotPlots wrote:I feel like the US price ($180) for this is definitely worth backing, but the UK price (£180) makes it a tough choice. This makes it out to be about £50/$70 difference, and I'd very much like to know where the extra cash is going.

To be fair (or unfair) that's how ALL transformers are priced in UK and Europe.
You guys get overcharged for reasons.
The cheapest place in the world for Transformers is definitely the USA overall. Why, I have no idea. They all come from the same factories after all.

I saw someone try to explain it as it's because the US price doesn't include tax, but the UK one automatically includes it, plus import fees (I think was the reasoning). I think this reasoning sounds the best, assuming it's true. I'm from the US, and not Hasbro, so I can't say this is accurate, but someone did the math and it seemed to work out to only overcharging by about $40 which is still a lot, but better than $70

Another reason I saw was that it's also because of the nature of exchanging currency, it's a better idea for Hasbro to overcharge because if the pound were to suddenly take a massive hit and loose a lot of value between the charge date and when Victory Saber ships, then they wouldn't actively losing money on a bunch of copies for the UK. That last reason doesn't stand up to logic because then the same would apply to the dollar, but obviously it doesn't, plus they wouldn't lose money because they charge when it ends and therefore would order the materials needed after charging

I think there are some countries covered by Takara or Hasbro in Asia that actually have the lowest prices overall. Possibly because they are physically closer to where the toys are actually manufactured? Robot Kingdom often charges less initially than most retailers. It's just that shipping is so expensive that usually prevents me from using them.

o.supreme wrote:I think there are some countries covered by Takara or Hasbro in Asia that actually have the lowest prices overall. Possibly because they are physically closer to where the toys are actually manufactured? Robot Kingdom often charges less initially than most retailers. It's just that shipping is so expensive that usually prevents me from using them.

In my experience, there have been times where RobotKingdom's lower price was low enough to offset the shipping cost, as the total cost altogether still ended up being cheaper than BBTS's price.

Sabrblade wrote:

o.supreme wrote:I think there are some countries covered by Takara or Hasbro in Asia that actually have the lowest prices overall. Possibly because they are physically closer to where the toys are actually manufactured? Robot Kingdom often charges less initially than most retailers. It's just that shipping is so expensive that usually prevents me from using them.

In my experience, there have been times where RobotKingdom's lower price was low enough to offset the shipping cost, as the total cost altogether still ended up being cheaper than BBTS's price.

Agreed. But in my experience, those are the exception, not the norm, which is why I said "usually" combined shipping is more expensive. Believe me, I always price compare between RK and most others. Shipping is usually the determining factor. It is nice though, for those that do want to pay a bit more and get their items before Pulse, and all other US retailers.

BotsNotPlots wrote:I feel like the US price ($180) for this is definitely worth backing, but the UK price (£180) makes it a tough choice. This makes it out to be about £50/$70 difference, and I'd very much like to know where the extra cash is going.

Extra cash goes to Hasbro's pockets, it's just the price for your country. Just like how oreo cookies cost half as much in Vietnam as they do in the UK. Price is based on GDP and median income (after considering cost and margins of course), basically what the company determined you can pay for stuff.

It's not 70$ extra though, it's less than that. Since the UK price includes taxes and the US price does not. Its more likearound 50$ extra. And you get to avoid any extra importing fees as well.

I'm so glad we're already over the halfway mark in just a week. Obviously orders are slowing down now but we should be well on pace to finish. I went ahead and ordered a second one to hold onto and eventually resell. The in-person photos look good. I'll be following this project eagerly.

BotsNotPlots wrote:I feel like the US price ($180) for this is definitely worth backing, but the UK price (£180) makes it a tough choice. This makes it out to be about £50/$70 difference, and I'd very much like to know where the extra cash is going.

Depends on where you live. Cost of shipping to England is higher than it is to the US due to multiple factors including distance, time in transit (usually double), and passage through the Suez Canal and associated fees. Another strong possibility is the national sales tax in England (which alone would add £36 if not included in the cost). Those are the most likely ones.

The fact that we are at halfway after a week is all but a guarantee he will make it, and probably obtain all of his extra tiers as well.

I am putting in a guess that the final number of backers will end up around 25,000 total.

I am so glad i backed this. Fingers crossed for it hitting production!

I backed this thing, but I am thinking about backing out.

The more I see of this figure the more it does not look like $180 worth of toy. It is basically a Commander Class toy selling at an inflated Titan Class price. It even looks like it is recycling blast effects from past Commander Class toys.

$100-120 seems like a fairer price for what they're offering. $180 seem a little bit high. Especially since $180 is $20 more than MP-24 Starsaber sold for and this toy isn't going to have Masterpiece levels of plastic, paint and sculpt quality.

william-james88 wrote:

Moonshot wrote:

william-james88 wrote:

Moonshot wrote:

william-james88 wrote:

sol magnus wrote:

william-james88 wrote:I read the IDW comics and loved them and the only time I remember black shadow is from the Megatron origin story and even then I am told that wasn't black shadow. Couldn't even say when he was in a badass scene as one of Megatron's top guys. So I really don't know him from there then at all. I just picked up the TR toy because it looked great. Still love him.

In MTMTE he was a Phase Sixer that beat up Optimus Prime and Ultra Magnus at the same time. Killed hundreds of Autobots that day.

What issue? Optimus Prime is not even in MTMTE since MTMTE happens after "the death of Optimus Prime".
Sounds like Black Shadow was only a mentioned in flashback then, and never part of the main story.

Anyways, Hasbro said there would be more partner sites for Victory Sabre coming out this week. Have any of you seen them? I'd like to write an article linking to all the different campaigns so that anyone in the world can know where to get one, all in one article.

Also, while I do think we'll get that first Tier, that canon is definitely key to the toy. Would be a huge shame for it not to be made. I would have rather it just be included and not have tiers, but I guess tiers are part of the deal with crowd funded things.

DW Optimus Prime didnt actually die in "Death of Optimus Prime". He just started going by Orion Pax again and went into semi-exile. He was in MTMtE in flashbacks and current time.

When did I say he did?

It sure seemed to me u were eluding to that here(also bold above); "Optimus Prime is not even in MTMTE since MTMTE happens after "the death of Optimus Prime"."

However, I never said u did say he died. Just in case u or someone reading it took what u said the same as I did, I thought I would clear it up. What did u mean then if not Optimus had died and that was why he wasnt in MTMtE?

That he is recedes ro the background and no longer goes by Optimus, which is what happens in the story that I put in quotations.

So yeah, Dark Shadow's role in the Roberts comics was beyond minimal.

Black Shadow was killed by the Decepticon Justice Division in their put em over big issue. MTMTE #7 I think.

To be on topic, I'll be doing my Star Saber x2 this week.

My main banking card expires in November. I know I can still make the purchase, and reverify later. however, to avoid all of that, I'll probably just get my new bank card early in October, about a week before the window to back this project closes, and get my new card then, and use it t make the purchase. besides, I have a couple pre-orders that are due early in October, as long as they are not delayed, it should work out perfectly.

whacko wrote:I backed this thing, but I am thinking about backing out.

The more I see of this figure the more it does not look like $180 worth of toy. It is basically a Commander Class toy selling at an inflated Titan Class price. It even looks like it is recycling blast effects from past Commander Class toys.

$100-120 seems like a fairer price for what they're offering. $180 seem a little bit high. Especially since $180 is $20 more than MP-24 Starsaber sold for and this toy isn't going to have Masterpiece levels of plastic, paint and sculpt quality.

I don't completely disagree, but I think you are overlooking 2 main points. First comparing the price to MP Starsaber's original price is just an unfair comparison no matter how you look at it. MP Starsaber was made 6 years ago before the MP line changed their pricing format and before the regular generations line did the same. If MP Starsaber was released within the last year, we would at least have a current comparable price (my guess would be around $200-$250 if released today). Generations deluxes could still be gotten for $10 on sale back in 2015 versus $10 for a core class now. Does that mean that core figures should be the size of deluxes because this is what their price point was 6 years ago?

Second is that there really isn't a great standard definition of what makes a Commander Class figure. So far, we just have Jetfire, Sky Lynx and Rodimus Prime to go by. Jetfire was the biggest and simplest, Rodimus was the smallest and by far the most complex, and Sky Lynx is somewhere in the middle. Comparing what we've seen so far, Victory Saber is definitely more materials and more complex than Rodimus Prime so the price going beyond the normal commander price point in into Titan range makes sense.

I have all 3 Commanders so far, and what they have shown for Victory Saber is definitely beyond what any of the 3 commander releases have covered.

Edit: tldr: If you are using prices from 6 years ago as your basis on whether something is worth it to you, the answer will almost always be no.

TF-fan kev777 wrote:

whacko wrote:I backed this thing, but I am thinking about backing out.

The more I see of this figure the more it does not look like $180 worth of toy. It is basically a Commander Class toy selling at an inflated Titan Class price. It even looks like it is recycling blast effects from past Commander Class toys.

$100-120 seems like a fairer price for what they're offering. $180 seem a little bit high. Especially since $180 is $20 more than MP-24 Starsaber sold for and this toy isn't going to have Masterpiece levels of plastic, paint and sculpt quality.

I don't completely disagree, but I think you are overlooking 2 main points. First comparing the price to MP Starsaber's original price is just an unfair comparison no matter how you look at it. MP Starsaber was made 6 years ago before the MP line changed their pricing format and before the regular generations line did the same. If MP Starsaber was released within the last year, we would at least have a current comparable price (my guess would be around $200-$250 if released today). Generations deluxes could still be gotten for $10 on sale back in 2015 versus $10 for a core class now. Does that mean that core figures should be the size of deluxes because this is what their price point was 6 years ago?

Second is that there really isn't a great standard definition of what makes a Commander Class figure. So far, we just have Jetfire, Sky Lynx and Rodimus Prime to go by. Jetfire was the biggest and simplest, Rodimus was the smallest and by far the most complex, and Sky Lynx is somewhere in the middle. Comparing what we've seen so far, Victory Saber is definitely more materials and more complex than Rodimus Prime so the price going beyond the normal commander price point in into Titan range makes sense.

I have all 3 Commanders so far, and what they have shown for Victory Saber is definitely beyond what any of the 3 commander releases have covered.

Edit: tldr: If you are using prices from 6 years ago as your basis on whether something is worth it to you, the answer will almost always be no.

What he said.

whacko wrote:I backed this thing, but I am thinking about backing out.

The more I see of this figure the more it does not look like $180 worth of toy. It is basically a Commander Class toy selling at an inflated Titan Class price. It even looks like it is recycling blast effects from past Commander Class toys.

$100-120 seems like a fairer price for what they're offering. $180 seem a little bit high. Especially since $180 is $20 more than MP-24 Starsaber sold for and this toy isn't going to have Masterpiece levels of plastic, paint and sculpt quality.

Due to the lack of economies of scale, this toy would never ever give you the same worth of $180 you would see at retail. Ever.

No different than 3p companies charging upwards of $40 for scout sized toys https://tfsource.com/ironfactory/IF-EX49-void-legion/

In both cases, you're paying that price because the sunk cost of making the master mold has less product for that cost to spread out upon.

If you want to ensure you get something worth $180 retail, then just stick to retail.

Of course, you would then miss out on toys like this that would never be found at retail, and that added rarity will definitely play into inflated secondary market prices. So not buying it now if you are slightly interested would backfire when your only chance of experiencing the toy is to spend $400 on e-bay.

Your best bet is to just back it now and if you don't like it when it's released, then just sell it then since there is guaranteed to be new collectors around then that simply were not around when this toy was being backed.

william-james88 wrote:In both cases, you're paying that price because the sunk cost of making the master mold has less product for that cost to spread out upon.

This is the biggest reason for the higher price. For the number of molds that will be required to make this to only get one use ever, likely under 30,000 units, they have to counter that with a higher price. Just at the minimum of 11,000 units they're looking at $1.98M, but the molds alone probably cost them $1M. Factor in material costs (plastics, screws, paints), packaging, factory expenses (facility expenses, wages, etc.), advertising costs (the emails and websites don't make themselves) and shipping and that $980K left gets used up pretty quickly leaving not much for them to actually make a profit.

Emerje

Even if you assume base retail price, Star Saber is a Deluxe (Saber), Commander (Star Saber), and Leader (Victory Leo), which equals $150 pricewise. $180 is a fair price to charge for this considering he's clearly got better engineering than retail figures and has a bunch of extra gimmicks.

Autobot N wrote:Even if you assume base retail price, Star Saber is a Deluxe (Saber), Commander (Star Saber), and Leader (Victory Leo), which equals $150 pricewise. $180 is a fair price to charge for this considering he's clearly got better engineering than retail figures and has a bunch of extra gimmicks.

Naysayers could argue that (like brings all those classes down one notch) and I'd rather not get into what a deluxe/voyager/leader/commander is with this guy since he is very much apart from the set price points for a reason. If people think the price is reasonable, and can work it out as you did, then perfect. But for those still not seeing the numbers add up, it's simpler to just go with the economies of scale notion.

If you're not feeling any toy, just don't get it. Even if everyone else loves it, it's not their collection and not their money. Value is subjective.

I'm still on the fence myself. Mainly because I don't have room and feel like I should stop collecting, especially after Kingdom's done.

But I do like what I'm seeing. IMO, this does seem like it's worth what they're asking for. It's like how people were saying Unicron could have been Titan class because he's about the same height in bot mode. There wound up being a LOT more to him; a lot of weight. VS is doing a lot.

My personal opinion is that if you want a Star Saber, this is likely going you be your best bet for a while. The MP is gonna run you more money, and doesn't come with Victory Leo. Sure you can get that 3P version but then you're getting into double the price before even getting the joint upgrades that are apparently required for the combination to be slightly decent. The other official Star Saber is the robot masters one, which is nowhere near as articulated as this one is, and isn't even deluxe sized. And if you even think about the G1 version, you end up looking at down payments for actually important things. Sure, this one isn't as tall as the MP, and it's made for CHUG scale, but it's kinda defaulted to being the cheapest option, while still being a nice set of figures.

All that said, if you don't think it's worth the money, don't get it. It might get stretch goals like the cannon, and it might get gap fillers, but this it's very likely the way it'll turn out. It's not gonna become MP scale or bigger or anything like that. So if this current package doesn't seem worth it, it probably won't become worth it to you.

I'm backing this bad boy. I love the design of Star Saber, I love how this figure looks, and I love that we're getting almost every gimmick faithfully updated. He is 100% worth the money in my eyes, but I also acknowledge that part of why I'm so excited is because I had basically given up hope of ever getting a new Star Saber after his loss in POTP, and after leakers claimed JG1 was dead in the water. Victory Leo being part of the initial package and not a separate tier or backer reward was icing on the cake for me.

Sentinel_Primal wrote:And if you even think about the G1 version, you end up looking at down payments for actually important things.

Now, if you wanna walk on the dark side there is (or at least, was) a G1 knockoff of Star Saber that was colored correctly. Not one of those "G1 reproductions", but one of the cheaper KOs that came with the brainmaster and the accessories. It was one of the first TFs I got when I was into collecting, so I'm sort of nostalgic for SS in thatw ay.

Gauntlet101010 wrote:

Sentinel_Primal wrote:And if you even think about the G1 version, you end up looking at down payments for actually important things.

Now, if you wanna walk on the dark side there is (or at least, was) a G1 knockoff of Star Saber that was colored correctly. Not one of those "G1 reproductions", but one of the cheaper KOs that came with the brainmaster and the accessories. It was one of the first TFs I got when I was into collecting, so I'm sort of nostalgic for SS in thatw ay.

Believe me, I've tried looking into that I have awful luck when it comes to finding KOs of things I want

TF-fan kev777 wrote:

whacko wrote:I backed this thing, but I am thinking about backing out.

The more I see of this figure the more it does not look like $180 worth of toy. It is basically a Commander Class toy selling at an inflated Titan Class price. It even looks like it is recycling blast effects from past Commander Class toys.

$100-120 seems like a fairer price for what they're offering. $180 seem a little bit high. Especially since $180 is $20 more than MP-24 Starsaber sold for and this toy isn't going to have Masterpiece levels of plastic, paint and sculpt quality.

I don't completely disagree, but I think you are overlooking 2 main points. First comparing the price to MP Starsaber's original price is just an unfair comparison no matter how you look at it. MP Starsaber was made 6 years ago before the MP line changed their pricing format and before the regular generations line did the same. If MP Starsaber was released within the last year, we would at least have a current comparable price (my guess would be around $200-$250 if released today). Generations deluxes could still be gotten for $10 on sale back in 2015 versus $10 for a core class now. Does that mean that core figures should be the size of deluxes because this is what their price point was 6 years ago?

Second is that there really isn't a great standard definition of what makes a Commander Class figure. So far, we just have Jetfire, Sky Lynx and Rodimus Prime to go by. Jetfire was the biggest and simplest, Rodimus was the smallest and by far the most complex, and Sky Lynx is somewhere in the middle. Comparing what we've seen so far, Victory Saber is definitely more materials and more complex than Rodimus Prime so the price going beyond the normal commander price point in into Titan range makes sense.

I have all 3 Commanders so far, and what they have shown for Victory Saber is definitely beyond what any of the 3 commander releases have covered.

Edit: tldr: If you are using prices from 6 years ago as your basis on whether something is worth it to you, the answer will almost always be no.

I'm not using prices from 6 years ago as my basis for whether this is worth the price Hasbro is charging. I'm using current prices.

Star Saber isn't any larger or more complicated than either Jetfire or Sky Lynx, both of which I also own, but the set does come with a Victory Leo which looks like a more or less basic voyager class figure.

Commander Class figures have generally sold for $90 and voyagers sell for around $30. $90 + $30 = $120

Haslab wants $180 for this set

Just looking at the prototypes, I don't think the quality they are offering matches the price. Victory Leo who I know is more or less an accessory, has visibly hollow thighs and arms. So does Saber. The brainmaster doesn't look like it has any articulation. The guns are visibly hollow, etc.

Starsaber looks good, and the Victory Saber combined mode looks good as well. I just think it look more like $120-140 worth of toys so far, not $180.

And I'm not opposed to spending money when I think it is warranted. I've purchased nearly $2000 worth of Transformers and 3P toys over the last two months. I just like getting good value for my money and I think Hasbro might be trying to pull a fast one.